Strategic HR: Driving ROI and Building Resilience Through Human Connections

Welcome to the Built by People podcast, where we share the stories and insights of the world's top HR leaders. Join us as we dive deep into the minds of HR executives, uncovering their strategies, challenges, and triumphs in shaping today's workforce. I'm excited to welcome Paul to the Built By People podcast. Paul, thank you so much for joining us. And as a starting question, I always love to ask if you could share a little bit more about your career journey. Sure.

Thanks, Dave. Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. My career out of MBA school, I went to work at a small little gas company called, well, it was Champlin Petroleum. It became Union Pacific Resources. So as part of Union Pacific, the railroad, 17 years there, finance mostly. Was fortunate to become a treasurer of a joint partnership with SoCal Edison. I was the treasurer for a cogeneration plant. They asked me finally to be the GM of that plant. So I ran that plant for a couple of years. Before we sold everything off and moved out of Southern California, moved back to Texas. And we got spun off from Union Pacific. They asked me to run benefits. They needed a finance guy in benefits, I guess. I said, I don't, all I know is how to sign up for my benefits. I don't know much else. And they said, no, no, no, that's fine. You'll, you'll learn. So I spent about 4 or 5 years in benefits and picked up a little comp at the time as well. Drove that for a while and then followed our CEO to a high-tech company, Cambridge Technology Partners, which in a couple of years was bought by Novell, a software company out of Provo, Utah. Novell unfortunately wasn't super healthy competing with Microsoft for the desktop. And so after, so I had moved myself back to Southern California, which was where I was from. And they said they didn't need me any longer. In my role, they were having layoffs about every November, we had about 10%. So, uh, I was 20 years out of MBA school. I was not a finance guy anymore, but I wasn't really an HR guy, no longer in oil and gas. I was not really a high-tech guy yet. And it was really difficult. I was fortunate to find a role as a consultant in a mortgage bank, IndyMac Bank, for a year. Started networking, met some people. Did a bunch of different consulting assignments and finally got hired as the VP of HR for Pioneer Electronics for 3 years. We cut that company in half. That was '08, '09, not great economic time. Then some more consulting and some more companies and interesting assignments. And then I got picked up by Broadcom, high-tech chipmaker. And I was there about 5 years, was a senior director HRBP. It was a global company, got to do some traveling, do some interesting places. That was great. Really broadened my background. Then they asked me to run recruiting for them globally. And I explained, well, I had never been a recruiter, but they had had quite a bit of changeover in their leadership for the recruiting team. So I stepped in and did that for another couple of years before the company was bought. It was one of the biggest tech deals ever at the time. $57 billion bought by Avago. We all knew we were leaving. We exited the company the day it closed about a year later, back to consulting for another couple of years. And then Carl Storz picked me up, which is where I am today. I've been here 7 years now, moved up from head of HR business partners to the VP role of the sales and marketing team. And then last year we brought us all together. And so now I'm head of the HR for the US. So. That's my career journey, as brief as I can do it.

Awesome, Paul. I mean, it's a long and meaningful journey, and I love how you started it in the area of finance. And I'd love for you to share some perspective on how a background in finance has shaped your approach to human resources and talent management.

Sure, Dave. I think I do come at HR differently than some, different skill sets. Really, I look at it as a business and we are part of the business. We help the business function better, hopefully. We're a cost center. So I don't go asking for big dollars on things that are hard to measure or that we can't afford at the time. So you make sure you're timing your requests at the right time for the business. You really need to try to see if you can get to your ROI. What is the ROI? What's the payback? What are we going to get from this? And so you really just start to look at it as, okay, if the company wanted to, they might be able to go outside. And if they did, what would they have to pay? And what would the benefit be of doing that versus having me and my team there? You know, and there is a lot of benefit. I'm not suggesting we should outsource. But, but that's always the challenge, right? Is how much are you costing? And when are they going to, if they don't see value, what's their alternative? They could do a PEO. They can, there's a lot of things they could do. So you need to make sure you're relevant and your costs make sense. So you've got to keep your cost in control.

Paul, you've been really passionate about hiring veterans at Carl's Stores. Can you share some insights about the value veterans bring to the workforce and how companies can better support their transition into corporate roles?

You know, we do love our veterans. We were fortunate to be featured on a Montel Williams show a year ago about our veteran hiring. We had 3 of our vets explain their stories. We just love them. They've done so much for our country. Even if they didn't go to battle, they've sacrificed some years of their life. Had to move around and, and then we also worry about the family. So we love to hire the spouses too, because they've also given to our country. Those veterans that were serving, they've had some really great training and learning in the military, and they can bring that over to us and they have this commitment to always do their best. The other thing is about that group, it's a diverse population. Every— a lot of people serve and a lot of different people serve. So it really helps our diversity. It brings in some different thought into our company, which is really great. You almost need to have your hiring managers have a class in how to read the resume. And you really need somebody to be helping the veterans fix their resume so that they read so people can understand. I need someone in purchasing. They may not use that word. Or logistics and how does that fit into your company? As they talk about these things in their resume, you have to be able to do some translation and you really have to help to do that. We've partnered with an outside group as well to help us to do that very thing. And it doesn't hurt to have someone or many people that are passionate about doing this. So I have a recruiter who's just thinks that every veteran she meets, she just is so pleased to have met them and to know what they've been doing. She's out to our recruiting fairs with the veterans all the time. We just see them staying and doing great work. So we're thrilled to have our vets.

Paul, you've experienced a lot of career transitions, one of which was when your company was acquired. What lessons did you learn about the importance of networking and building relationships throughout your career during those times?

Yeah. Thank you, David. That's one that makes me chuckle. I had no idea when I lost my first job after 20 years with Novell, and I was in between everything. It was very difficult. And I called the 7 people that I knew closely. They were mostly internal people to Union Pacific where I'd worked for 17 years. And they didn't have jobs for me. I was new back to Southern California, but I wasn't in the old industry I had been in. So I had to make new, meet new people. And I can't even explain the value of the network, right? And it took a long while to build and it snowballs if you do it well. And it's not about how many people do you know on LinkedIn? In fact, I refuse many or most on LinkedIn that are cold, that they just send a note, I want to be part of your network. And there's no value in that for them or for me, really. I'm another number. They're never going to refer me to something. I'm never going to refer them to something. You refer people you know. So what I ended up doing was I would go to industry or a function breakfast or functions, whatever they might have at dinner, a discussion. And I broadened it. I didn't just do HR things. I would do operations things. I would get with the Harvard MBA subgroup in Orange County. I wasn't a Harvard MBA. I was a Virginia MBA, but we had actually an association. So I would go, I could go and I would meet new people and each one, I'm not all that outgoing. So I would call myself on the introverted side. So I was never that comfortable, but What I decided, what I learned was to pick 2 people, get 2 people that you talk to and get their card and say, hey, can I follow up with you? And then set up a coffee or a lunch and spend some time. And you don't have to know, it's not about they have a job for you. No, they never do. But I've met so many great people and I was thrilled to do that. There were times when I was driving to some, you know, another 45 minutes to another coffee and thinking, you know, why am I going? I don't know. And I'd get there and I would just be amazed. The wonderful people. And then you share your stories and then it's, you know, how could I help you? How, you know, they ask the same and you share information. I heard about a job over here, you know, and so that is really such an invaluable resource. I wish Young people, I hope that they are doing that from the start of their careers. I certainly missed a lot of my career in doing that. Once I did, I have been so blessed with so many wonderful people.

Thanks for that, Paul. Great lessons to take away from, from that response. And hey, from your experience as both a GM of a power plant and an HR leader, how do you balance the business metrics side of HR with the human element?

You know, the decisions are sometimes supported by the numbers and they're just obvious. We're doing poorly. We're going to have to have a layoff. And we execute that as HR and we do it with as much respect as we possibly can. And we help people out and help them try to get into their next roles. But the harder roles or the harder decisions really are the soft ones. Just in the last several weeks, my company's based in El Segundo, it's right by LA. We've had the fires. And so what does a company, what's our responsibility for victims of the fire? And we had Harvey down in Houston. We have a lot of people down there. A lot of people got their homes flooded. What can the company do for these people? These are soft decisions. What are we willing to do? What can we do? What can we afford to do? Can we give them a few nights in a hotel? Would we pay them as if they were working even though they're not? Or are we going to make them take vacation? Right? We actually have, have been able to have some giving. We've got a little fund and we've been able to give some people a little money. It doesn't begin to cover, right? You can't pay for somebody's home and all their belongings, but you can let them know you care. And so that's what we did. We tried to let our people know we care. It's part of our DNA at my company and it makes my company special. But those are the harder decisions is what, what, what are you going to do? And if you're doing it this time, will you do it next time? Will you do it for this person and for that person? You know, because you've got the whole diversity issue as well and you don't want to discriminate. That's not what we're about. We're about trying to be fair and trying to do what's right. So those are the hard decisions, I think.

Paul, you've mentioned in the past that you view HR as a business unit that needs to deliver value. How has this perspective influenced your leadership style and decision-making?

Our president of our US division here always talks about thinking about the enterprise, be an enterprise thinker. I got an MBA. I don't just know HR. And in fact, some people know HR better than I do, but I try to contribute everywhere. And then the other thing is, and I mentioned it earlier, you asked the question, you know, what are the alternatives and what's the value we're adding? What are we bringing to the table that the company is pleased to have? And in small snippet, I thought about recruiting and everybody kind of knows, well, if you go outside to an outside recruiter, you're going to pay 20% or 25% more than that for an executive recruiter, of course, but let's just use 20%. So I said, well, let's take all of the costs we have. We've got X number of recruiters. We've got LinkedIn licenses to recruit. We've got advertising, you know, marketing materials, got all this stuff. These are all costs. And then we divide that by the salaries that we recruited. So if you add up first-year target salary or target salary and bonus and make that division, were you under 20%? Because if you're not, you might as well outsource all your recruiting, right? So it gives you a real-world comparison about, well, if we outsource All of the recruiting, we might even be able to do better than 20%, but can we really get down to 11% or 8%, which is what we're paying today? It's just another way to look at it and to do a double check to make sure that you can enunciate, really talk about the value that you're bringing.

Paul, any advice you'd like to share with our audience?

Network, network, network. That's number one. People are great and you need great people on your side. You need to have a little board of directors to help you stay afloat, to stay centered. You, the networking really is a two-way street. You need to help others and you need to spend time with others that you can help. And then lastly, and this was something I got a marketing poster in the mail once, and it was a Norman Rockwell used to paint the front of a Saturday Evening Post, the magazine. There used to be a magazine back in like the, before my time, like the '40s. I don't know. But Norman Rockwell was a famous artist and he wrote, he made a self-portrait picture. He was painting himself. So he had an easel. He had a picture of himself he was painting. He had a mirror. In that mirror was a picture of himself that he had painted. He had the back of himself was being painted so that you could see the whole picture. And at the bottom, this marketing poster said, every job you do is a self-portrait. And that's the takeaway for me was every job. So it didn't matter if it was some big job, some little job, everything you do is a self-portrait. You leave behind your brand. This is your brand. So you need to deliver. And I'll close with one example and not that I'm anything great, but I had done some recruiting. I subbed as a head of HR while I was doing that. We recruited for another head of HR. That person came in, it didn't work out well. And I got paid not only for my hours, but also a recruiting fee. That person left in, let's call it a month or two. And I didn't give them a guarantee that said, days, but I wasn't going to take that whole fee. I paid it back. So just do the right thing. Right. So that's, those are kind of my last closing words. I hope some of that could land on somebody's ears and somebody could appreciate that.

Paul, thank you so much for joining us on the Built By People podcast. It was a pleasure to have you involved.

Thank you very much, David. I appreciate the opportunity.