Lamari Brayboy Lii
Head of HR & People Ops
Thoughtworks
Episode 98
Unlock HR's true power: From cost center to profit driver with data-driven strategy.
Current chapter: Built by People podcast features insights from world's top HR leaders
Built By PeopleJuly 21, 2025 · 12:31
Thesis
“HR must evolve from a perceived cost center to an indispensable strategic business partner by adopting a data-driven, cross-functional approach, translating HR initiatives into measurable business value, and integrating deeply with financial and sales objectives.”
Show notes
Lamari Brayboy Lii was a corporate attorney before he fell in love with developing people. He built a consulting firm that grew to 150 people, then moved into HR — and brought a lawyer's discipline for quantifying outcomes with him. At Thoughtworks, that discipline produced something concrete: a leadership development program with a demonstrable $1 million annual ROI from a 10% reduction in manager turnover. The funding ask was $250K. The math wasn't complicated. But most HR leaders never build the model.
His argument is direct: HR is treated as a cost center because HR communicates like one. The fix isn't better storytelling — it's better metrics. He made the shift from "time to hire" to "time to productivity," embedding HR directly into cross-functional conversations about headcount, client contracts, and margins. When HR is in those rooms, the language changes. When HR is absent, the business fills the gap with assumptions.
He also makes an underappreciated case for internal marketing as an HR function. Benefits with low utilization rates aren't a product problem — they're a communication problem. Partnering with internal marketing teams to treat HR programs like campaigns (complete with influencers inside the organization) dramatically shifted how employees engaged with what was already available to them.
- The $1M ROI case study: how a $250K leadership program reduced manager turnover by 10%
- Why "time to productivity" is a more powerful HR metric than "time to hire" — and how to connect it to revenue goals
- How HR can influence sales strategy by aligning client pursuits with actual and projected talent capacity
- Why internal marketing partnerships are the fastest way to improve underutilized benefits
- The professional development hack that costs nothing: ask to be in cross-functional meetings you're not currently invited to
This episode is brought to you by Previ — an employer network that saves employees thousands on the necessities they already pay for, at no cost to the company.
What you'll take away
- 1Quantify HR initiatives using cost-benefit analysis, projected outcomes, and benchmarking against industry standards to effectively demonstrate ROI and secure leadership funding.
- 2Empower HR professionals by involving them in cross-functional business conversations (e.g., headcount, customer contracts, margin) to deepen their business acumen and strategic understanding.
- 3Shift HR metric focus from 'time to hire' to 'time to productivity' to directly correlate HR efforts with revenue goals and speak the language of business leaders.
- 4Leverage internal marketing teams to craft appealing communications for HR programs, increasing engagement and utilization of benefits like mental health services.
- 5Foster an 'interdisciplinary' approach across departments, inviting all stakeholders into problem-solving discussions to achieve shared targets and reduce single-source accountability.
What most organizations get wrong
- •HR should influence sales strategy by aligning client pursuits with current and projected internal talent resources, rather than sales solely dictating hiring based on external demand.
- •Professional development for HR professionals can begin internally by proactively engaging in cross-functional meetings within the business, offering a cost-effective alternative to external conferences.
In Lamari's words
“we were able to reduce turnover by just 10% and save the business about $1 million annually.”
This quote powerfully demonstrates the financial impact of an HR initiative, showing how a seemingly small reduction in turnover can lead to significant cost savings and justify investment.
“What's more important, we found by being in these cross-functional meetings as times to productivity and that direct correlation to revenue goals.”
This highlights a critical shift in HR metrics from traditional hiring speed to a more business-centric measure directly tied to revenue generation.
“The reality was that two things were true. What's also important is that we're selling to the resources that we have today and the resources that we know we're going to be obtaining over the course of the next quarter, right?”
This quote presents a contrarian view on sales strategy, suggesting that HR insights into current and future talent should inform sales targets, not just external demand.
“Leveraging our internal marketing team has really helped increase utilization for a lot of the benefits that we have low utilization on.”
This emphasizes the practical benefit of HR collaborating with internal marketing to improve employee engagement with existing benefits, showcasing a tangible ROI for marketing partnership.
“Ask to be invited into meetings that typically you wouldn't find make sense for your department, but see what you can take from that in order to influence your role, your department, and overall the business at the end of the day.”
This advice encourages HR professionals to proactively expand their business acumen and influence by seeking cross-functional exposure, framing professional development as an internal initiative.
The problems this episode addresses
- •High turnover among mid-level managers, leading to decreased productivity and morale.
- •Difficulty for HR to secure funding for initiatives due to challenges in demonstrating clear business ROI.
- •The perception of HR as a cost center rather than a strategic value-add to the business.
- •Low utilization rates of valuable employee benefits, indicating poor communication or lack of perceived value.
- •HR professionals lacking foundational understanding of financial metrics like P&L statements, cost modeling, and ROI calculations.
- •Ineffective internal communication strategies for HR programs, leading to overlooked information and low employee engagement with initiatives.
- •Sales departments focusing solely on external client demand without considering the existing and projected internal talent pool and capacity.
In this episode
Built by People podcast features insights from world's top HR leaders
Built by People
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Lamari demonstrates ROI of an HR initiative to secure funding
How to Demonstrate the ROI of an HR Initiative
Omari says enabling HR professionals to be in cross-functional conversations is key
WSJD Live: HR as a Cost-Center Partner
Omari uses internal marketing to strengthen HR branding across the organization
How HR Branding is Being Strengened
Omari: Invest in professional development can start directly inside your business
Stay Curious
Topics covered
Organizations and entities mentioned
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