Emma Hayes
Chief Learning & Development Officer
SECU
Episode 111
Beyond Content: How a Listening Strategy Transforms L&D in Times of Change.
Current chapter: Built by People podcast features insights from world's top HR leaders
Built By PeopleJuly 11, 2025 · 15:12
Thesis
“Effective learning and development initiatives, particularly in times of organizational disruption, must be founded on a robust listening strategy to truly understand employee needs and capacity. This approach, rather than content-first methods, builds trust, fosters engagement, and ensures alignment with strategic priorities for measurable impact.”
Show notes
Navigating Technological Transformation with Empathetic LeadershipIn this episode of the Built by People Podcast, the host welcomes Emma, a seasoned HR leader, who shares her career journey and experiences in people and organizational development. Emma discusses the challenges her organization faced during a technological transformation compounded by an unexpected CEO transition. She emphasizes the importance of empathetic leadership, transparent communication, and a listening strategy to address employees' concerns and build trust. Emma describes the development and implementation of a strategic listening approach, which included pulse surveys and feedback sessions to identify key issues such as trust and uncertainty. By slowing the pace of change and focusing on critical elements, Emma was able to re-engage employees and improve engagement and communication. Her parting advice highlights the significance of starting any learning and development initiative with a solid listening strategy and ensuring alignment with organizational strategic priorities.00:00 Introduction to the Built by People Podcast00:38 Meet Emma: A Journey in HR01:15 Identifying Leadership Gaps03:28 Developing a Listening Strategy07:16 Overcoming Implementation Hurdles10:04 Impact and Results12:20 Parting Advice for HR Leaders15:05 Conclusion and Farewell
What you'll take away
- 1Prioritize a 'listening strategy' (e.g., pulse surveys, feedback sessions) at the outset of any L&D initiative to genuinely understand employee pain points and capacity, rather than making assumptions or leading with curriculum.
- 2Align all learning and development efforts directly with organizational strategic priorities to ensure impactful execution and demonstrate tangible value as a support function.
- 3Recognize and actively address 'change fatigue' during periods of high organizational flux by adjusting the pace of new initiatives and prioritizing the most critical elements, allowing employees to integrate changes sustainably.
- 4Implement a 'consistent shared leadership language' and leverage structured frameworks (e.g., from Center for Creative Leadership) to equip leaders with tools for adaptive leadership, psychological safety, and effective change communication.
- 5Cultivate an environment where leaders can model vulnerability, acknowledging challenges like change fatigue, which helps build trust and increases employee re-engagement and collaboration.
What most organizations get wrong
- •Hayes challenges the conventional L&D approach that often starts with content or curriculum, advocating instead for a listening-first strategy: 'Too often learning efforts really begin with content, or they begin with a curriculum... But if you build your learning initiatives on a strong listening strategy, you're going to have a measurable impact on your overall learning culture.'
In Emma's words
“My career journey was haphazard. I found myself in a few positions early on in my career that really situated me for where I am today. I love people. I love knowledge exchange.”
This quote offers insight into Emma Hayes' foundational passion for people and knowledge exchange that shaped her career path.
“The best thing for us to do at that moment would be to listen. So, I created a listening strategy that we rolled out so we could capture feedback from our leaders. So, rather than to just make assumptions about what we thought they might need and create a bunch of initiatives and programs that may or may not hit the mark.”
This highlights the guest's core philosophy of grounding L&D strategies in actual feedback rather than assumptions, crucial for effective change management.
“One of the major components that we used to do that was we built a consistent shared leadership language, so a common leadership language that we could really anchor conversations around change across the organization.”
This emphasizes the strategic importance of a unified communication framework in guiding leaders and employees through organizational shifts.
“Change fatigue. So, by the time we started rolling out leadership development initiatives based on what we'd heard, our employees and our leaders, they were at capacity. There had been so many shifts and transitions in the organization... So they were mentally and emotionally, like, fatigued with all of the changes that were coming down the pipe.”
This identifies a critical hurdle in implementing new initiatives: the pervasive impact of 'change fatigue' on employee and leader capacity.
“If you build your learning initiatives on a strong listening strategy, you're going to have a measurable impact on your overall learning culture.”
This serves as a direct statement of the guest's core thesis, linking a listening-first approach to tangible improvements in learning culture.
The problems this episode addresses
- •Clients struggle with significant mental and emotional disruption among employees and leaders during unexpected leadership transitions or technological transformations.
- •Leaders are overwhelmed, finding it difficult to manage their own roles while simultaneously supporting their teams through widespread organizational uncertainty.
- •Organizations face an influx of misinformation, leading to confusion, speculation, and mistrust when transparent communication and empathetic leadership are lacking.
- •Employees and leaders experience 'change fatigue,' reaching capacity for new initiatives due to a continuous stream of shifts and transitions, hindering engagement and adoption.
- •Companies find it challenging to build or regain employee trust and engagement when new programs are perceived as 'one more thing' rather than genuinely addressing felt needs.
In this episode
Built by People podcast features insights from world's top HR leaders
Built by People
Meghan Markle shares a little bit about her career journey
What Is Your Career Journey?
Emma identifies a gap in employee readiness or leadership capability at her company
The Need for Empathetic Leadership
Emma says disruption in leadership was creating a readiness gap for the company
How To Close the Development Gap
Emma, as you begin rolling out these learning and development initiatives, what were biggest hurdles
Employee Engagement and Change
When we deployed our listening strategy, we saw noticeable improvements in employee engagement
WSJD.com Exploring the Strategic Pulse of the Company
Emma advises anyone working in learning and organizational development to start with listening
Learning and Organization Development: Starting With a Strong Listening Strategy
Topics covered
Organizations and entities mentioned
Full transcript
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