HR Leadership: Balancing People & Data Drives Real Business Impact

Welcome to the Built by People podcast, where we share the stories and insights of the world's top HR leaders. Join us as we dive deep into the minds of HR executives, uncovering their strategies, challenges, and triumphs in shaping today's workforce. I'm excited to welcome John Caldwell to the Built By People podcast. John, thanks so much for joining. One of the first questions I always love to ask is tell us a little bit about your career journey.

Sure, Dave, thanks for the time. And pleasure to be here. So I've always been in human resources. I've been with, I've got what, 25 years in HR by now. I had a couple of short stints early in my career, the first in a manufacturing facility, automotive manufacturing facility in central Indiana for a company that's Meritor Automotive now. And I was an HR generalist in a unionized plant of about 600 employees. So it was a great kind of, you know, learn by or trial by fire sort of experience. And then spent a couple of years as a recruiter for U.S. Bank, high-volume recruiting across a number of different divisions. So that was great exposure to various aspects of a business and the corporate side of life, I would say. Then 14 years with Fifth Third Bank, and felt incredibly fortunate to have that experience. They— I believe Fifth Third had and still has a very forward-thinking HR function, and had really 3 unique experiences during that 14-year run. For the first 4 years, I was in a field HR role, HR business partner, HR director role in various markets within Fifth Third. The second 4 or 4 and a half years that I was there, I was the corporate HR business partner or business partner lead. So groups such as finance, audit, marketing, HR, a small team and I were the HR business partners for those groups. So totally different view of the business, which was interesting and learned a lot. And then the last 5 years or so that I was with Fifth Third, I was fortunate enough to be able to lead I'll call it an org effectiveness team. We called it human capital design at the time, but we were really charged with, we were in some ways an internal consulting shop. So I had a diverse and broad skill set on my team and we did things like change management efforts, large-scale strategic initiatives. It was like, hey, if instead of going outside for a third-party consultant to lead this effort, one of our team members may be able to do that for you. So things like strategic workforce planning or launching a competency-based approach to talent management. And then we were also— did a lot of user experience work as we stood up new technology there as well. And then was able to parlay kind of that combination of business partner and talent management OD experience when I joined Valvoline in late 2016. It was an interesting time because Valvoline has been a around for over 150 years, but in 2016, we split from Ashland Oil and became our own publicly traded company. So it was a great opportunity initially to lead, uh, the talent management and org development function that included talent acquisition and stand up processes, systems, and really build out, uh, those functions. Did that for a year, year and a half, and then shifted my focus to be, uh, the HR business partner lead for their products business. In North America as well as the corporate team. And then in, in 2020, right as COVID hit the US here, I stepped into the chief people officer role and I've been in that role for coming up on 5 years now. And it's been no shortage of fun and challenges in that 5 years. We, like everyone else, navigated COVID. And then as we were coming up for air from that, announced intent to separate our business that resulted in the sale of our global products business to Aramco that closed in early 2023. And now we're a pure-play high-growth retailer operating in just over 2,000 stores across the US and Canada. So I've really enjoyed the chief people officer role and just the variety that that brings.

John, you've had a journey of both endurance and transformation at Valvoline. Ascending from the senior director of global talent management to the chief people officer for an organization that does $2 billion in revenue and has around 12,000 employees. What have you had to learn to get to where you are today?

Yeah, still learning, obviously, and still learning this. I would say balance is the keyword. And in a few, you know, areas or ways I describe that, one would be kind of in human resources, I think it's a role that requires balance between relationships and the connections that you build and the— just the interpersonal capital that you develop and making sure that everything that you do in leading your team and directing your efforts is data-driven, that you're speaking the language of the business, that there's a foundation behind if we do X, then we think Y will be the outcome. And we're basing that upon the insights that we've been able to derive from the analysis that we've done, given the way we've looked at turnover or hiring or diversity. So I think that, that balance in relationships and being data-driven is one. I think a healthy balance, this has been something I'd like to think that I've done fairly well in my career, between strategic agility and execution. We've all probably worked with people who are incredibly strategic and the most visionary, intelligent, you know, human beings that you'll ever meet. But sometimes you can't convert that into action and results and then vice versa, right? You also, There are people who don't, maybe don't pause and reflect before just jumping in and rolling their sleeves up and, and getting things done, but maybe they're the wrong things. So I think that balance between strategic agility and execution is critical. And then the third, I think that I've learned and I'm definitely still learning is that kind of balance between, you know, work and personal life or, or, and then oftentimes you'll hear now kind of the work-life integration, but just making sure I, I know, I know this, I know I'm at my best when I'm one, organized, two, well-rested and recharged. And so, you know, there are many times that I find myself not being either of those. And so I think that's the constant thing that I have learned and am still learning. Self-awareness is there, self-management isn't always there, but just making sure I've got that balance between, you know, attending to myself and attending to the job at hand.

John, what's a major challenge you faced in your career as an HR executive, and what did you need to do to overcome it?

You know, the— I think in HR and in this role, I think a couple of things come to mind. So first would be pace, that your time is not your own. You may walk in on a Monday, Tuesday, whatever, and you've got, here's your to-do list, these are the priorities, and then something's dropped on your plate that that, you know, takes precedence over everything else. And I think some of that pace is driven by variety. And, you know, I enjoy that. That's actually one of my favorite aspects of human resources is that, you know, you go from, you know, there's the very analytical side of it as it relates to looking at, as I mentioned earlier, turnover data as an example, or the exec comp piece of it, the benefits piece of it, shifting into the employee relations, you know, ensuring that we're kind of advancing our culture and some of the softer skills, leadership skills aspect of it. So I think that pace and variety are the biggest challenges. For me, I think the way that, that what I've learned and again, continuing to get better at every, every day hopefully is, is really relying on my team. So, you know, the, the further up you ascend in an organization, the larger your remit is. The less you can do on your own. So it's really key to surround yourself with people who are stronger than you, especially in the area that you've tasked them to lead. And, you know, the more organized and the clearer I can be in setting expectations for them and then just let them run, it's amazing what, what that team will

accomplish. Cost considerations. Are often a centerpiece to any business strategy. I'm curious to get your perspective on how you balance the need for cost-cutting measures with the importance of investing in things like human

capital. Yeah, and it's, and it's every year, right? You think you get over one, you know, hey, we're really kind of tight on the budget this year, and then you get to next year and it's the same story, right? Every company, every economic cycle, it seems I think priority prioritization and staging is critical. So I think what, you know, you can't do it all. You've got to be as a leader willing to say no to your team or to the business as it relates to getting, you know, greenlighting projects, budget, headcount adds. And so I think having a crisp strategy and vision that's aligned to the business, hey, this is what the business is driving. These are the 3, 5 things that we're really going to double down on. We can't be great or we can't improve everything today or this year or over the next few years. So this is where we're going to hang our hat because we think it's going to have the biggest impact. And so I think if you can prioritize, you can't do it all. You can still, though, build the right business case for the things that are going to matter most to the business. And I think the other half of that is as you tighten that focus, you get your team aligned on the strategy is also obviously important to ensure that strategy is rooted in the business and get the executive team aligned on that as well. So ensuring their awareness of and advocacy for the things that you and your team are trying to do and the why behind it, I think that's critical. I've found through the years and, you know, HR is generally— we're not very good marketers a lot of times, and a lot of it is kind of internal marketing and promoting of what you've done, the impact that it's had, what you need to do, that compelling vision and story for the future, I mean, I think you have a much better, you have much better odds of getting the green light for the investments that you wanna make.

I wanna talk a little bit more on that. You know, HR obviously must exert a lot of influence and excel at negotiation and, you know, the marketing of their ideas to drive decision-making and get buy-in at the C-suite level, what advice do you have on the topic of influence and negotiation that other HR leaders can learn from?

Yeah, you know, so credibility isn't built overnight, right? Or earned over time, just like your reputation. So I think starting with just relationships, relationships are critical. You know, as you enter into a new role, as you start to work with new leaders, investing time to make that personal connection, to learn about their business, to learn about them as professionals, as human beings, is key. You know, it's amazing how much rope you can get if you've got the right relationships with your colleagues, with your leaders that you support. Consistency is key. So, you know, if— what I've found is, you know, as you build that relationship, if you're consistent in your thought process, in your priorities, in what matters to you, in how you make decisions, then people will be able to rely on you on that consistency. And what you'll find is your team and even your, your, your colleagues in the business will sometimes know what you're gonna say and how you're gonna think about something even before they come to you, you know, looking for, for a decision. And, and part of that consistency is if it's based in facts, logic, and a consistent rationale. So I think, you know, Part of the influence and being, being effective in negotiating from our HR chair is sometimes removing your personal interests or positional interests from the situation. So they know they've got, you know, a neutral third party in the room, or they know that when you're bringing something and trying to promote, sell, get buy-in for something, that, hey, this is in the best interest of the organization. I know where John's coming from. I know how he thinks. This is rooted in the facts and data. I think that goes a long way. And then I think the other thing I would say as it relates to influence in negotiation, and this has probably been a learned trait for me through the years, 'cause as a, you know, still recovering people pleaser, is just being willing to say no and have a backbone in human resources, taking a stand. You know, we are certainly a support function and an enabling function within the organization, but that doesn't mean that that we're always supporting and serving and at the beck and call of the business, right? You have to have that backbone and that position and that voice that allows you to be assertive when you need to be assertive and take a stand. And also realize that there's a time when, you know, you may have an opinion and you may feel strongly about something, but if it's not that important and it's not illegal, or out of compliance. I also coach my team sometimes that like, there are hills that are, it's not worth dying on, right? Like if you're constantly battling and, and, and, and defending your position, you can become, you know, a bit of a, a burden or a hurdle for the business that they'll try to avoid whenever possible. So I think also picking your spots when it really matters, and that's when you hold the line, helps be, helps you, helps ensure that you're better at influence and a better negotiator.

John, I want to go back to this topic of work-life balance because it's something that you brought up in the beginning. How are you helping your team address issues like burnout and work-life balance, especially in like a service or retail-centric environment?

You know, I point to a couple of our values. So one of our values is recognize and celebrate achievement. And retail is fast-paced. It's, you know, great day. Now let's go do it tomorrow. You know, we're opening the stores the next day, the next week, the next month, the next year. So I think pausing and acknowledging the milestones along the way, you know, whether they're performance milestones or, you know, work anniversaries, things like that, just pausing and taking a timeout to celebrate those goes a long way, showing how grateful you are for that ongoing commitment of the team. Another value is We say make our jobs safe and fun. I think the fun piece really matters. You know, it's— retail is a tough business. I think one advantage we have in our stores is it is very much a team environment. The team works together. Every vehicle that pulls into one of our bays, it is very much like a pit crew. You've got, you know, 3, 4 people on the team working on your vehicle at any given time. And so How do you make that fun? How do you make that high energy so that the days fly by instead of drag on? So I think those are a couple of things. And then I think for all of our team members, whether you're in a corporate office setting or in a store, you know, we try to make sure that we encourage the right mental health tactics. Take your— we have a generous paid time off policy. Take it. We want you to take it. We don't want you to to carry that over to the next year. And I think modeling the way at the top is critical as well.

John, any parting advice you'd like to share with our community?

You know, the one thing I would say that has helped me in my career is just get as close to the business as possible. You know, ask, listen, learn, get in the field, schedule introductory meetings with leaders that you support. You know, I think that, that is just so critical. If you can speak the language of the business, if you can understand their challenges, their day-to-day, you're going to be so much more successful. So part of that is building relationships. Part of that is understanding the business, the business, the financials behind it, what makes it tick. But I think that that's, that's something that's just incredibly critical. And a nice way to do that as well is— and this is easier earlier in your career— is is take as many different opportunities inside or even outside of HR. Even if you go outside of HR and run a P&L or run a business, get in the business for a couple of years and come back, or seeing different aspects of human resources from comp to talent acquisition to OD, business partner, etc. It's incredibly helpful that those different vantage points that you can, that you can take on.

John, thanks so much for joining us on the Built by People podcast. It was a pleasure having you on. Thanks so much, Dave.

Appreciate it.